Your Sins tips, let me be having them

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Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby St0nkingByte » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:12 pm

By Sins I don't mean your despicable drinking, smoking and other unmentionable habits I mean the delightful Sins of a Solar Empire.

I believe I have spent sufficient time with the game and have upgraded my skills from 'Completely Worthless' to 'Mildly Incompotent'. Now given that I have not the time to hang online with you guys and 'hook up' for your 'hot' multiplayer action I was wondering what general strategies you are finding useful in the game?

Oh sure I could search the Sins forums but the pain for me as such a casual player to embark upon such a search, well let's just say it's far easier to ask you isn't it?
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby Darwin » Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:30 pm

Take careful note of the ability to increase your logistics or you may find yourself trying to fight off the universe with 10 frigates and some tears.
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby BigDXLT » Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:41 pm

Beware of pie rats! Yar!

I have nothing useful to contribute at this time.

I mean, "as usual."
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby Florp Incarnate » Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:56 am

Here's an incredibly informative spreadsheet made by ex-fogies zzSleeper and Jabberwock.

I don't know if this link will work... you may have to be logged in... if it fails I will send you a link.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key= ... SZb8xF6WUw
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby St0nkingByte » Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:57 pm

Florp Incarnate wrote:Here's an incredibly informative spreadsheet made by ex-fogies zzSleeper and Jabberwock.

I don't know if this link will work... you may have to be logged in... if it fails I will send you a link.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key= ... SZb8xF6WUw


I don't have permission to view that. :?
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby The Nighthawk » Wed Mar 12, 2008 9:24 am

I grabbed this on the weekend and have been giving the game forums a look-see and have picked up a bunch of useful info. For instance, did you know your first capital ship is free to build? There seems to be a general build order for the first 30 seconds and a couple key items in future progression that help tremendously.

1. You start with 2 construction vehicles a frigate factory and your planet and mine-able rocks. Queue a cap ship factory, and a crystal extractor for the vehicles, 2 scouts for your factory and increase your planet's population. Also, buy a couple hundred crystal from the black market.

2. Set your scouts on auto-explore (fire and forget ftw!), queue up your two metal extractors, and your first cap ship. There are a number of theories for cap ship selection, but my best track record is with the colony cap ship. Also grab a couple light frigates for cap ship escort.

3. You have enough fleet room for 10 light frigates (after your scouts die) and should get those as you are able. The first couple to escort your cap ship should be enough for your first asteroid colony or two, but you'll want 5 or more when it's time to tackle your first real planet . You will also want to get two civilian research stations and research the trade building. You will need to bump up your homeworld's logistics slots to build the trade building itself, or alternatively, you can scrap your cap ship factory since you won't likely get another until later when your front line has moved several systems away.

4. Don't worry much about defenses to start. A hanger at your forward world's should be enough to deter most scouting early in the game. Plus your front line should be moving enough that you won't know where your defensive line should be for a while.

5. After that, it's pretty much up to you. :)

I haven't played much past the hour mark in a game yet, but I've got two cap ships, a full 250 point fleet and 6 worlds by then usually. A couple of notes about tech, make sure that what you spend is worth what you get. Most weapon upgrades aren't worthwhile until you have the second logistic researched giving you over 250 points of ships, and in the early game, most civic upgrades aren't needed like the cheaper buildings and reduced build time They're pretty fast and cheap enough already, especially if you're only playing a small map. Crystal will be your shortfall, so don't be afraid to spend money on the market to get it if it's slowing you down. Trade will boost your money income significantly. Also, ALWAYS upgrade your pop on a new colony to it's maximum. Never break this rule, it will cost you money.

I hope that's useful. :D
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby St0nkingByte » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:48 pm

Does having more than one trading port at a planet (or planets) help juice up your economy?
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby The Nighthawk » Thu Mar 13, 2008 8:00 am

It will. It seems that the longer a string of trade ports you make (there may be a limit of 5 or it could just be a limitation of the maps I've played) increases the credits every one generates. If you make more than one at a given planet, the second will not increase the income each port produces, because it's not increasing the length of the chain, but it will add as much income as the one you already have there.

On most of my systems I've had to increase the logistics slots to put more than one trade port, so the combined cost wouldn't pay itself back for quite a while and the increase wasn't worth the short term hit, to me anyway.
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby The Nighthawk » Thu Mar 13, 2008 9:21 am

Also I forgot to mention this:

Clans of Sin

Great page with interactive Tech trees and such.
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby Florp Incarnate » Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:00 pm

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pBUjXLiUllcrJSZb8xF6WUw


Apparently the patch has changed some of these values, but it is minimal.

Behold the glory of that spreadsheet, basically.
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby M373ora Fr34k » Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:25 pm

Tip for killing pirates permanently:

You will never never never never be able to beat them with numbers. As the game drags on longer their home fleet & the number of gauss cannons defending their base grows into a monstrosity. The only way to beat them is to lure them into a tight space and then smash them with an area effect weapon. I've only played the Traders so far but their only solution is the Marza-class capital ship's Missile Barrage ability. Without that your 700-upkeep fleet will succumb to the pirate's superior numbers. I lost all my frigates plus my repair ships before i finally got wise.
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Re: Your Sins tips, let me be having them

Postby M373ora Fr34k » Tue Mar 25, 2008 10:36 pm

Hmm i'm in the mood so I think I'll give a bit of a TEC unit guide based on my experiences with them:

Fighters

Not too useful. Fightercraft can only be spawned by capital ships, carriers, and defensive hangars and can never be built by themselves...thus they don't generally come in great numbers. So why do you need a fighter that is only good against fighters? A single Garda flak frigate is the equivalent of several fighter squadrons. The only time I would consider using fighters is for defensive hangars when I know the enemy likes to deploy lots of bombers when he invades me.

Bombers

The more useful fightercraft. In numbers they can dole out a good pounding. A great solution against most frigates and defensive turrets. Strangely you can't use them to bomb a planet but oh well. Bombers are maneuverable enough to evade anything but anti-fighter units, so they are really useful for trashing an enemy planet's space buildings while your capital ships stay safely out of enemy turret range.

Cobalt Light Frigate

One thing you have to learn in Sins is unit balance (if you've played Star Wars Empire at War then you know what I mean). It's not recommended to go Starcraft on your opponent and rush him with tons one type of unit. Your small ships are critical for forming a forward line and protecting your big ships. The Cobalt Light Frigate is your basic front line damage-soaking unit. Any fleet you deploy will probably have at least a dozen of these even late in the game, until you get access to Kodiaks. Cobalts cost no crystal to build, so they are extremely cheap for what you get.

Javelis LRM Frigate

A unit with as much downside as it has upside. On one hand it has long-range missiles that can really hurt. On the downside it has paper-thin armor and practically anything can destroy it without breaking a sweat. I highly recommend that you put them in their own seperate fleet from the rest of your forces, so that you can easily keep them a safe distance from the frontline fighting.

Krosov Siege Frigate

A not-so-good unit overall. It's specialization is bombing enemy planets. Don't see the need for that as your capital ships can already bombard. In the early game if you go straight to researching them they might have some use for bombing a planet faster. surprisingly, their anti-ship weapons aren't that bad and can make Cobalt Light Frigates sweat in the early game (but later with upgrades the the Cobalt will nail them).

Garda Flak Frigate

A frigate that is highly effective against bombers. Always include one or two of these in your fleet and micro them to focus on enemy bombercraft in the middle of a battle. Don't extend them too far out because they will die fast to focus fire.

Percheron Light Carrier

Your only offensive access to fightercraft outside of capital ships. Include just enough of these in your fleet to supplement the bombers your capital ships have. In a large fleet with 4 or more capital ships probably 3 Percherons will be enough.

Hoshiko Robotics Cruiser

An important ship to have. It repairs your other ships mid battle and with an upgrade can temporarily knock out enemy ships. Having 2 of these in your fleet is recommended so they repair your fleet as well as each other. If you are short on logistics 1 is enough. Just don't let the enemy destroy it. With Hoshikos in tow, your fleet can go through several fights in quick succession without succumbing to battle attrition.

Kodiak Heavy Cruiser

BOOYA! The only ships at your disposal with more punch than these babies are capital ships, and capital ships have a severe unit cap while Kodiak's don't. Kodiaks are tough, possess good firepower (after upgrades), and are fast. They are basically a bigger brother of the Cobalt Light Frigate and a pack of these can mess up anything except fighters. Kodiaks become your frontline unit once you are able to research them. A squad of Kodiaks can be used to go deep into enemy territory and destroy their facilities before the opponent has time to respond. This is because with their relatively small size it takes very little time for them to set up for a Phase Jump. A fleet with capital ships in it takes a while because cap ships are slow and clumsy.

Cielo Command Cruiser

Useful for one thing and one thing only: destroying enemy capital ships. Get the "Designate Target" upgrade, use it on an enemy capital ship, then focus all your fleet's fire on it to blow it away before it can run. Cielo's are fragile however so keep them in the back.

Kol Battleship

In Counterstrike there is a shotgun known as the "noob cannon" because anybody with half a brain could kill with it. The Kol Battleship is the Noob Cannon of Sins. It has very strong direct-firepower and is well armored. It can deploy it's own squad of fightercraft, fire off a powerful anti-ship weapon to damage a single target, fire off a burst of flak to wipe out nearby bombers, put up an extra shield to protect itself, and temporarily drink steroids to turn itself into an ogre for a short amount of time (that's only partially a joke). In short Kol Battleships have EVERYTHING. They are almost 100% the ship you want to pick for maps that give you your first capital ship for free.

Sova Carrier

A good support ship whose uses are rather more indirect than the Kol but still quite useful. Primarily it's good parts are a) It carries as many squadrons of fightercraft as 4 Percherons and b) It's Embargo skill. Embargo is awesome. When present at an enemy planet it essentially cuts off any trade routes passing through there and blocks unit production, all while stealing enemy income at that planet.

The description for Embargo only says that it slows down enemy ship/building production and steals some resources which by itself doesn't sound impressive. That is until you realize that "slows" means enemy production time is increased by about 300-400% (basically halts production), and "steals" can actually take ALL of the enemies resources at that planet and give it to you. So this means that if you plop a Sova in the enemy system, they can't panic-build turrets or ships to stop you, AND all the resource extractors and taxpayers that they built there are working for you all at the same time! If the opponent can't dislodge you than he's practically given you control of the planet without you even bombarding it.

Akkan Battlecruiser

Another support ship, although this one is more combat-focused than the Sova. It's got an Ion Cannon to temporarily knock out enemy ships, a passive aura that boosts your fleet's offense, and an area-effect ability (Armistice) very similar to the protoss arbiter's Stasis ability in Starcraft. Akkan's are worth their price if your fleet is big.

Dunov Battlecruiser

A pure support ship (though it still has enough firepower to smack frigates that get too fresh). It's abilities are all direct support. It can repair allied shields, drain shield and ability energy from enemy ships (aka Science vessel's EMP shockwave in Starcraft), disable enemy abilities, and boost allied ability energy. A good ship thought not a frontline unit.

Marza Dreadnought

This ship is an absolute monster. You could argue that it's even better than the Kol. It's less durable than the Kol but has considerably more firepower and has tons of abilities for piling on the damage. It's Missile Barrage ability can singlehandedly blow away an entire enemy fleet no matter how big it is, and it's got tons of every type of weapon. It's also got the strongest planetary bombardment ability. I dub this capital ship a walking pile-o-guns.

Kols and Marzas should ALWAYS be the flagships of your fleets. Only build Akkans and Dunovs as secondary capital ships and only if you've got the money and resources.

That's it.
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