Canadian Federal Election 2008

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Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby CanadianWolverine » Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:21 am

Who else watched the debates?

To keep it short, IMHO Elizabeth May was the most respectable and I will very likely vote for her party in my riding.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Pykl » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:56 am

I was thinking about watching it but I happened to stumble on harper ranting for a minute or so and had to stop before teh gag reflex set in.

This election is probably the worst I remember. They aren't talking about what they want to do, instead they are just saying "well you don't want those guys so vote for me."

My sister votes green all the time but she's personal friends with mother earth. I used to vote for who I liked best but really that doesn't impact anything and a vote for the green is frankly a wasted vote, it's like voting for the canadian naked llama party. They stand no chance of winning or having any influence. They just steal votes from one of the main parties so that the least environmentally friendly team wins. It's a bit ironic when a vote for green causes more environmental damage.

Nowadays I tend to vote strategically so I research my riding to see what past results have been and then vote for who has the best chance of knocking off the conservative. My main beef with them is I'm a big supporter of public health care which they are hell bent to destroy, particularly if they get a majority. Also Harper and the conservatives have shown themselves not to be trustworthy and you can bet the hidden agenda is waiting until they win a majority.

Although it was a different party I still have a big grudge against mulroney from back in the pc days. This post is way longer than intended so I won't bore you with that rant.

Layton might be a good bet but the ndp can't mind the candy store very well. So I don't know how I'll vote. Anyhoo I better stop before I depress myself.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby CanadianWolverine » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:25 pm

I think "wasted vote" talk just goes to show how badly we need proportional representation. Still, doesn't it seem odd that they used to call Reform a wasted vote and then they even formed official opposition at one time. In the case of the Green, it doesn't seem like people who voted for them last time around wasted it since Elizabeth May got to participate in the debate, resulting in more exposure for the party. Heck, to be honest, before I heard that other parties and CTV were trying to keep her out the debates, I hadn't even heard of the Green Party and now I feel like I have found an option that seems to have a pretty straight talking, intelligent leader with pretty decent policies, especially considering I've always liked "green" tech more than other options (hydro/wind/solar vs coal/petrol) and they claim to be conservative on budgets aka no deficit spending - its not like being a debt ridden country is very popular these days. And I used to vote Reform/Alliance/Conservative, but my reasons were I realized the status quo needed to change from the corrupt Liberal old boy's club ... but then they toss most of those nice ideas of reform aside and pursue a Neo-Con agenda?!? WTF. That is not why I voted for them, I feel dirty knowing what they did collectively with the support I gave them. Elizabeth May and the Green Party championing proportional representation is far more closely representing my views these days than what I see as Nazi Lite. *throws up a little* Sorry, I feel ill and irritable, I think I have been reading too much up on politics so I have a semi-informed vote, I should go game for a bit.

Oh, don't the government aka Elections Canada even give money to a Party based on how many votes they get, so a vote for those MPs closest to your values doesn't seem wasted that way either, since its like I am giving them my money in a round about way.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby BigDXLT » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:11 pm

For starters, I personally am a believer in "vote for your representative" rather than "vote for the party". I too think we need to move past the first past the post system and get proprortional representation going. I'm still disappointed that it didn't happen in BC actually. I don't care who's in charge, so long as if the person I voted for can at least yell at the idiots that are, that'll make me happy. I am also not making a crack at the conservatives, I mean that with the utmost neutrality. Whoever takes it is going to be the idiot wrecking this country four years later...

If you're going to "get into it" I recommend checking this out: http://www.howdtheyvote.ca/ That site makes it easy to see what your incumbent MLA did.

And http://www2.parl.gc.ca/parlinfo/Lists/Party.aspx is interesting as well.

Personally, I'm not sure who I want to vote for yet. I went to the all canidates meeting last Monday, just so I could see who all there is in my riding to vote for.

Liberals: Right out. The canidate was new, and seemed nice enough, but the spent most of the time with "uhhs".
Christian Heritage Party: The only other canidate that has been on a ballot before, wasn't too bad of a speaker, but as a semi-Pastafarian I dont' think I could vote for this guy.
Conservatives: Our canidate is the former mayor of my hometown. She did a good job as mayor, as far as I'm concerned, but I know is not very tech savvy, and when I asked about her stance on Bill C-61, the copyright reform, she had no idea what it was other than "it was good for artists?" Also made lots of "Party X are bad because they want to do this and that blah blah blah" statements.
NDP: (Incumbant) He had the better answer to my question, as well as a number of other questions. While I disagree with the party line, I do think the NDP would make a better opposition than the Liberals.
CAP: The old lady here was hilarious. For someone obviously not there to get votes, and not a public speaker, I give her credit for having the guts to go on a public stage and say the things she did (Tweedle-dumb and tweedle-dumber to refer to liberals and conservatives) but the tin-foil hat she was wearing even better. I mean, I'm sure there are a billion conspiracy theories involving 9/11 and all that, but every problem in canada seemed to stem from the great american cabal of corporations. Even CBC losing the hockey night in canada theme song had an afghanistan poppy seed propping up wall street mention! It was hilarious!
Green: This guy was pretty good too. He knew damn well that he wasn't gonna be voted for in this riding, even joked about it quite a bit, but could answer serious questions quite competently. I have to admit, they do have a few good ideas.

And with that, basically, the biggest thing these other parties can provide ideas for the future. Like both the CHP guy and Green party guy said, even though the NDP hasn't been a threat to the Duopoly of old for the last 50 years, a lot of their ideas have been implemented. Basically, as the "major" parties see these up and comers coming along, gaining popularity, they start to go "oh, we need to steal that idea" and such. The idea is, don't ignore the canidate you like just because they don't stand a chance toppling the guy you hate. And I agree with that mentality.

As far as the debate goes, I didn't even bother. I'm not interested in what those guys have to say. Harper is a robot, Dion is a Quebecer, Layton has a mustache, and May has rabbit teeth. I'm not voting for any of them.

And like Pykl, every time I see "don't vote for party x" messages, I dock points. That's such a lame tactic. Personally, I'd prefer to see a big spreadsheet with all the areas the party wants to make changes in:

For example:

Code: Select all
                            Federal Pie Party   |         National Cake Coalition |  Crazy Cat Lady  |  New Republican Party
Free Pie iniative  :    Strongly For            |     Strongly against            | Not available    |     Maybe
Cake Tax           :    Increase                |     Abolish                     | No change        |     Decrease
Apple inspections  : Yes (see also Free Pies)   |      Yes                        | Yes              |     No
etc
etc
etc


Preferably, all done offically, with lots of inline links so I can get more info on the topic. Maybe grouped for the really fine details. Anyone know of such a thing?

I don't really care about all the kittens Jack Layton is going to kill, or all the homeless people that Harper is going to personally shoot with his rifle. When it really comes down to it, I don't think the whole country is doing that badly. I mean, it's easy to be bitter and/or apathetic about it all.

Side note: Other than kids that got dragged to it by parents, me and one other guy were the youngest people at our All Canidates Meeting by a long shot. I didn't know the other guy, but when it was opened to the floor, his question was exactly the second question I had in mind, to do with their thoughts on the aforementioned proportional representation, even down to the context of the recent facebook vote swapping thing that's been happening, which I thought was interesting.

Anyway, I've really gone off rambling now...
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Mentat » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:51 pm

Conservatives always win the riding I live in, but I'd never vote for them. But I don't like Dion either. Might just have to vote Leyton again.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Pykl » Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:49 am

Ya the whole proportional representation thing would be great federally although I've never heard it mentioned anywhere but BC. The party system sucks as a whole and lets the big parties do what their big contributors want without a second thought for what might actually be good for us peons. I think the last few years of minority governments has been a good thing because they actually must work together and compromise. It ends up better for us Joes in the long run. The party system is fairly disfunctional and free votes would be fantastic, oh ya that was one of the reform/alliance/conservative main principles until they got a sniff of power and it went out the window faster than a naked guy in Langley.

I used to work for the press and was a bit of a news junky. That experience brought me into close contact with politicians of all stripes and all levels of government. Nearly all of them are similar and arent' really interested in governing for the people and will generally do whatever they think will give them some advantage. I developed a sour taste for all politicians during this time and can't be bothered much with them anymore.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Good Eats » Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:53 am

Pykl,

There is no such thing as a wated vote! Read below then vote!

Green Party Website wrote: "The parties that receive over 2% of the national vote get $1.75 per vote cast from taxpayers. When you cast a vote for a party, you are not only saying that you approve of their values, but you give them your $1.75 to support their policies and future campaigns."


http://www.greenparty.ca/en/node/1099

Pykl wrote: ...

My sister votes green all the time but she's personal friends with mother earth. I used to vote for who I liked best but really that doesn't impact anything and a vote for the green is frankly a wasted vote, it's like voting for the canadian naked llama party. They stand no chance of winning or having any influence. ...
Don't drink and derive. Alcohol and calculus don't mix.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Pykl » Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:03 pm

I know if I had a $1.75 I could change the world.
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby Florp Incarnate » Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:32 pm

^ I would buy ice cream...

Cool link BigD!

My old man used to be riding association president for the Conservatives in Vancouver South so I hear all the inside scoop of the inner workings. It's all pretty interesting... which cultural group is most likely to give the most votes, how to market to them, getting people to put up big signs, etc. Turns out that individual riding associations have a fair amount of power when it comes to influencing party policy. I just remember the old man telling me of the time when Harper and a few cabinet members came for interviews with the Van South association and the former Reform party people were brutally critical of them for spending so much money... "which party is this again" etc hahaha :) Lets just say the PC and the Reformers don't get along so well..

Liberals are same old same old. They have no principles. They just say what the most amount of people are most likely to vote for. I would rather vote NDP, (which holds principles I am diametrically opposed to) than Liberal. At least the NDP has a philosophical foundation.

Too bad Marc Emery and the Marijuana Party isn't federal ;)
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Re: Canadian Federal Election 2008

Postby CanadianWolverine » Sat Oct 11, 2008 5:21 pm

I was sent this link and found it interesting, thought some of you might as well since I think some of you use torrents, right?

http://torrentfreak.com/canadian-democr ... ng-081011/
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